Energy Transfer LP (NYSE:ET)

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  • Lou: Happy New Year all - For years, on the last day of trading, I've made a buy based on my perception (is it guess?) of something that I believe will perform well next year. Generally, it's been a stock in which I already had a position. This year it won't be different. I am now trying to decide on today's buy. The candidates are $ET $EPD $DBRG $FTI. I will post my decision as soon as I enter the order.
  • Lou: @Lou $ET $EPD $DBRG $FTI - as tempted as I was to buy more of all four, because it is a smaller position of mine than the other three, I added to $ARDX.
  • jonwest88: @Lou $ET $EPD $DBRG $FTI $ARDX I chose months ago and added a few times to $ET, still paying over 9% too. For exploration investment still have a small profitable position in $FANG.
  • Lou: @jonwest88 $ET $EPD $DBRG $FTI $ARDX $FANG - good choice - $ET is such an oversized position for me that I can't add any more. It's what I call my "one decision investment.'" Because distributions reduce one's basis (they're treated for the most part as return of capital), on sale they are gains, and on top of that there would be significant depreciation recapture, the tax bite on sale would eat away much of any gain. At my age, and with the great tax deferred cash flow, I'm determined to hold $ET (and $EPD) for my estate. At that time, under current tax laws, there would be a step-up in basis and my heirs would be able to sell without tax consequences. That said, I think that it's still a great buy, even today.
  • Lou: Added to $ET and started pilot position in $RELY, Otherwise, horns still in.
  • champ: PipeLine-Companies.....$KMI $ET $PAA....Day-1 on this turn off of their most recent lows.
  • Lou: Looking to weather a possible recession. I continue to build my LT bond portfolio and assured cash-flow vehicles. Added to 30year TBills and $TLT $TLTW. Also abit more to my overloaded $ET at 13.27.
  • champ: @Lou $KMI $ET $EPD #construction #many-projects #large-list .....Unlike you, I'm a #trader off of Charts...and on this stock, this is #Day-4 off of the most recent #double-bottom....so I'm up nicely already because I had Entry-timing........ and now we will see where this goes in the next few weeks and months and if the Markets turn lower again.....I will for sure take #profits again...... ....every time I post on this stock, you always post the same thing to me.... however I #understand, that you hold your stocks a long time through bad markets and I don't..... ....for me I always try to capitalized off of the drops....... and good Luck to you also.
  • champ: @Lou $KMI $ET $EPD #construction #many-projects #large-list ....Lou ...I just want to point out to you again, that I'm a professional-trader, been doing this for over 45 years.....and you were a full-time Attorney.....
    ....and I was a full-time Stock ...
  • Lou: @champ $KMI #construction #many-projects #large-list - Good luck with the $KMI - I love pipeline companies but, in spite of the K-1s, my faves are two MLPs, $ET (now a relatively gigantic position in my portfolio) and a full position in $EPD. To me. because of tax considerations, they are one-decision investments that will be sold by my/my wife's executors when each of us dies and the estates can get a step-up in basis. I also own a ton of long date calls in both and short puts in $EPD. My bottom line on $KMI is that I wish you well in your investment but that's one in which I have no confidence and wouldn't touch in any timeframe.
  • mopick: $ET, reportedly big option trades in advance of their earnings next week leaning heavily bearish. Have a relatively small posiiton in this as I prefer $EPD. I've owned $ET in the past but have always been a bit leery of management due to their past discretions.
  • Lou: @mopick $ET $EPD - I'm very long $ET and have a full position in $EPD. To me, at this time, the units are #OneDecision investments. You buy and hold forever because selling them involves all sorts of unhappy tax consequences. Their #options are decent trading vehicles, but the MLP units won't be sold until, at death, the estate takes a step-up in basis and sells the holding. Despite the history screw-ups, I have total confidence in current $ET management and expect to continue to enjoy the generous tax deferred or advantaged (capital gain if out of basis), ever increasing distributions. The pipeline assets and other infrastructure are impossible to duplicate and are critically important to the energy security of our country.
  • Lou: While today they are not the flavors of the day, I'm handcuffed to very large positions in my two MLPs - $ET and $EPD. Very large distributions well covered and were I to sell in my lifetime I'd needlessly pay lots of taxes.
  • mopick: $EPD, new high. Long-term hold for me. $ET, back in, got an upgrade from RBC, $18 price target. $EPD is my go-to in this space, however.
  • Lou: @mopick $EPD $ET - love them both - I have very substantial $ET position and good sized in $EPD. I think that RHRN $ET is a much better buy as it has a higher yield and better upside.
  • Lou: @MongosPawn $FTI - you're welcome, but I'd be adding RHRN. Same with $ET and $EPD.
  • jarmstr278: @Lou $ET $EPD #StepUpInBasis I agree both are great positions.
  • Lou: While @AndStars and @indigo1948 have posted good stuff in response to my $ET $EPD post yesterday, here’s my take:
    When I invest in marketable securities I look for those that I believe will significantly increase in value and/or will provide me ...
  • Lou: PS to my post about $ET and $EPD - these investments are not suitable for IRAs, Roths and other tax deferred accounts!
  • Lou: There has been much discussion on both the SMM and OMM boards about generating cash flow. I've been using two MLPs to generate a significant tax-deferred return for many years. The ones I use are $ET and $EPD. I'm happy to elaborate with a longer post if there exists an interest in this topic.
  • indigo1948: @Lou $ET $EPD - both of these have been long term holds for me Lou - great dividend generating machines but patience is required with these issues. I would be interested to hear about the tax-deferred aspect.
  • farview: @Lou $ET $EPD Lou as you and others have stated MLPs with their K1s are not suitable for most retirement accounts. Do you or others have any favorite ETFs in the space since they do not generate K1s?
  • vscottg: @Lou $ET $EPD Yes, would be glad to hear more on your approach. Thanks for all of your comments.
  • sincity45: @vscottg $ET $EPD I’ll second that.
  • AndStars: @Lou $ET $EPD Thanks, Lou! I'm interested. (There's a few folks that posted over on OMM that are interested, too.)
  • AndStars: @Lou #ELPs $ET $EPD

    Looking forward to your post, @Lou. I appreciate your experience with these investment instruments very much.

    Before you post, I'll give a summary of my understanding of ELPs and how they may offer tax advantages to those seekin ...
  • Mounty: @Lou I have been using $EPD for years. I have a nice gain as well as an 8% distribution while I hold. My company was bought out a few years ago by $ET. The MLP world has been pretty good for me inspite of waiting for K-1's for tax purposes.
  • Lou: Sticking with my #Energy positions - $ET $FTI - both very big; $RIG - half of a position; $DVN $WFRD $HAL - lesser. As another #anchor-to-wimdward, added to my #MarylandMuniLadder. Done for the day, I think.
  • Lou: Explanation for the $ET drop this morning - pipeline fracture in OK - quickly shut down and remediation in process. Likely no significant consequences, it's in OK not PA, buying opportunity.
  • vitoB: @champ $LPG $PAA #Tankers ...the space is logical, but saw some insider sells that makes me hesitant on this name, it will still probably work. I like $ET and $MMP in same space but np in either.
  • champ: @vitoB $LPG $PAA $ET $MMP #Tankers ....Always have to expect that Insiders will take some profits off, stock holders never like that, however thats why they invested from below or why they are working for the company, shares are part of their income......and as we all know, always need to alway pay attention to the total number of shares that they are holding after the sale....... .....and there are always family reasons, that need $$$ for many reasons.. that we could think of. I'm in with a full position and I'm hoping that #Tanker-rates will keep climbing.
  • Lou: Rolling some of the cash I raised into more $ET. The usual caveat - not for IRAs and similar tax deferred portfolios.
  • Lou: I've got the energy bases covered - Big - $ET $FTI Moderate $RIG Starters - $DVN $HAL $WFRD Not for today or even this month, but I'm expecting a ramp up.
  • maracom: @Lou $ET $FTI $RIG $DVN $HAL $WFRD I'm rooting for you. I have a history of selling too early
  • Lou: @Lou $ET $FTI $RIG $DVN $HAL $WFRD Ouch! My starters could have been better timed. Fortunately, they're starters.
  • mopick: $ET/$EPD, pipeline companies doing well! $ET, new high, $EPD, almost there as well! What's not to like? Price appreciation plus dividends of over 7%.
  • Lou: @mopick $ET $EPD and, IMO, $ET is still cheap. It is by far my largest holding and IMO likely to get to 17-19 in fairly short order. $ET restored its distribution to pre-cut levels and is pledged to continue distribution increases on a quarterly basis. Current yield is almost 9%, tax deferred. CAVEAT - NOT SUITABLE for tax deferred accounts such as IRAs.
  • Lou: I'm overloaded with energy services, holding very large positions in $ET and $FTI (now up more than 100%) but I jumped on $RIG per suggestion here. Thanks.
  • Lou: Listening to webcast CC for $ET 2nd Q report. Pretty upbeat, though it won't move my needle on this MLP, as I'm full and holding for sale by my estate after my demise and step-up in basis, as MLP tax consequences would be very costly were I to sell during my lifetime.
  • Lou: @Lou $ET - my post below made me decide that I don't need to hear the rest of the CC, as I'm holding in all events. Going out for a walk instead. Have a good night all.
  • Lou: Big earnings day for me tomorrow - in addition to $RELY, I'm waiting for $OXY post-, and $ARDX $BRSP $ET, all pre-.
  • jonwest88: @bigbartabs $ET I hear ya. I plowed as much as was allowed into Keogh MP and PS plans along with an IRA. In at retirement I moved all of the Keough money into an IRA. In the past 2 years I became more aware of r.m.d.'s and increases in Medicare B and D rates based on incomes. I started a few years ago converting, now I am accelerating that. At 73 I am looking at making most if not all charitable donations directly from my r.m.d.of my IRA. As a retiree I now pay a lot more income tax than before, as I no longer have all the self employed business deductions.
  • bigbartabs: @jonwest88 $ET ... good show on managing your retirement accounts. So do you find yourself essentially sending what would be a tax check to the IRS, now to your charities? A lot easier to write that check!
  • Lou: Another one I like more than a lot is, by far, my largest position, $ET. Warning -it's an MLP and not suitable for tax-deferred accounts such as IRAs, but I see about 50% upside from here. You gotta take into account tax consequences if you buy.
  • trtl: @Lou $ET What about in a Roth IRA? tia
  • Lou: @trtl $ET - same issue. Sooner or later tax complications can occur and it's just not worth the potential problems.
  • trtl: @trtl $ET @Lou The Roth would not be “tax deferred “ since the tax has already been paid. Correct? I realize this is a duh question, but I am easily confused 🤷‍♂️
  • trtl: @Lou $ET oops. I did not see your reply before my last post. Thanks for the info
  • bigbartabs: @trtl $ET ... not Lou, but you are exactly right... if assets in a Roth... no taxes ever. My problem has been that as soon as Traditional IRAs came about... I could see that was going to be an exceptional way for me as a young guy (I think it happe ...
  • Lou: @bigbartabs $ET - no disagreement as to how Roths work. Just a cautionary note - Roths are not exempt from UBTI which is generated in varying degrees by MLPs. There are other tax issues involved, but I'm not offering tax advice here. Please do your research on the tax issues that are involved if you wish to buy MLP units in any kind of IRA.
  • antfarm: @Lou $ET Lou Would you please define UBTI. My old brain can decipher it.
  • Henry: @antfarm $ET Unrelated business taxable income https://www.investopedia.com/terms/u/ubti.asp I've only been hit by the 15% tax on it twice in decades of owning partnerships. The biggest pain in owning a partnership is some of them put out the K-1 close to April 15th I agree with Lou that Roth's are not exempt.
  • Lou: @antfarm $ET - Unrelated Business Taxable Income.
  • wildfire3d: @bigbartabs $ET #ubti https://www.investopedia.com/ask/answers/102714/can-i-own-master-limited-partnerships-mlp-my-roth-ira.asp
  • antfarm: @Lou $ET Thanks
  • wildfire3d: @bigbartabs $ET and IRA conversions. I just completed the conversion process you described. I used conversions from the roth to bring the non-roth IRA down to the level that my MRDs (Minimum Required Distributions) equal my charity targets. As a result i make my MRDs via QCDs (Qualified Charitable Distributions) so my income is NOT increased by the MRD. Most large brokerages make the QCD process easy, (i used fidelity). If you contribute to any 501(c)(3), do it with a QCD, at least up to the point of your MRD.
  • bigbartabs: @wildfire3d $ET ... so I guess essentially you are sending you tax checks to your charities... rather than the IRS?
  • trtl: @bigbartabs $ET Thanks for the reply. Somehow I don’t think your problem is too bad of one to have. Lol, but good luck with that. Thanks again for your reply
  • Lou: @mopick $BRSP #yield-hog - I have a great deal of respect for Ray Merola, but principally because he does such a great job on $ET my single largest holding. There are others with whom I often agree, but I haven't take the time to back-test them. Beware of the students and other newbies who get published but are frequently flying by the seats of their pants.
  • Lou: Getting #ArtificialUnintelligence via a #Benzinga #SPAM from one’s broker is repulsive! Yesterday FIDO ATP carried a Benzinga post that said $ET reports earnings today (it last reported in May and is due to report again about 8/1). Today Benzinga reported the May Q1 earnings as news. The problem is that FIDO is so big that there’s no one in authority who is reachable to take care of such miscommunications.
  • Lou: @Henry #Energy -- ..and when we do sell it, the pipeline companies carry it to the buyers. Still love $ET in this space and it yields 9.75percent with the tax-deferred distribution increasing every quarter. I post the following about every time I mention an MLP - NOT SUITABLE FOR IRAs and 401s and similar.
  • Lou: IMO there's a buying opportunity RHRN in $ET. I'm overfull the units but the LEAP calls for 1/25 look great this morning. I'm overfull those as well. Now I'll SHOUT- this MLP, like other MLPs, IS NOT SUITABLE FOR TAX DEFERRED ACCOUNTS! Hold only in taxable accounts.
  • Lou: My $FTI and $ET are finally performing again!
  • woodman: @Lou $FTI $ET - I took your advice and bought it in April under the 50 day within the consolidation, and I've just let it do its thing.
  • Lou: @woodman $FTI $ET - I guess that you're referring to $FTI, not $ET. Nice trade with a lot more upside IMO.
  • woodman: @Lou $FTI $ET - yes, FTI.
  • traderbren: $ET -- @Lou -- not sure if you are still holding $ET but it looks like you might be in good company: Energy Transfer The Trade: Energy Transfer LP ($ET) Executive Chairman Kelcy Warren bought a total of 750,000 shares at an average price of $12.79. To acquire these shares, it cost around $9.59 million.
  • Henry: @traderbren $ET I'll bet @Lou quotes Charlton Heston
  • Lou: @traderbren $ET - not unusual - he's been buying with both hands with frequent adds. I'm full and holding until they pry it from my dead cold hands - @Henry - not Heston but maybe Eastwood.
  • Henry: @Lou $ET sorry my friend, I'll bet Clint wishes he said it. Charlton did
  • Lou: @Henry $ET - looked it up - you're right. Heston was the proverbial quote machine.
  • Lou: @Henry $ET - quotes aside, the taxation aspects of MLPs such as $ET makes them most suitable for ownership by codgers and for holding until one's estate can sell them without tax consequences. Lots of tax deferred income during one's lifetime, and step up in basis upon death with no concern for taxable gains or recapture of depreciation. The problem LT holders run into is that at some point the handsome distributions cease to be tax deferred as they run out of basis. So they add more units to create more basis.
  • Henry: @Lou $ET They were the last one to send out their K-1. I got rid of ET for that reason.
  • Lou: @Henry $ET - the late K-1 doesn't affect me - I've been using extensions for many, many years now. More important to me is the fact that on sale I'd have to pay taxes on the tax deferred distributions I get and on recaptured depreciation. As you pointed out, if I hold it until my death, my estate gets a step up in basis and the depreciation recapture goes away.
  • Lou: They call me "often wrong but seldom in doubt." I've been redeploying proceeds from my $DDS sales to $BRSP $FTI and $INZY. IF I weren't too overloaded with $ET, I'd be buying that as well, hand over fist.
  • Lou: @Lou $DDS $BRSP $FTI $INZY $ET --- also added a bit to $ARDX
  • Lou: $ET filed a shelf registration for 44.47 million units on behalf of Lotus Midstream in connection with the immediately accretive acquistion of the Lotus pipeline network. Good opportunity to add for the LT. I particularly like the common units and the 1/25 $8 LEAPs. Bidding on more of the LEAPs.
  • :
  • Lou: $ET reversed to the upside and the LEAPs I hold are moving higher as well.
  • Lou: Continue to add $ET #LEAP calls, now holding 1/19/24 $10 and $12 and 1/17/25 $8. Unable to add common units because I already own more than a sane, reasonable investor should own. So I'm just building on the calls.
  • mopick: @Lou $ET #LEAP, think it went ex-dividend today!
  • Lou: @mopick $ET #LEAP - yes. The close yesterday was adjusted for the .3075 payable on 5/22
  • Lou:
    Another positive note reaffirming my conviction about $ET.

    The Daley Note: May 5, 2023

    Build it, and producers will fill it. That seems to be the mantra these days for natural gas infrastructure in the Permian Basin. The latest evidence comes from ...
  • woodman: @Lou $ET - Nice move for $FTI today, too.
  • Lou: @woodman $ET $FTI - viewed from my posts, I may look like a #one-trick-pony. I admit, I am that. I hold and post about very few names, and that's by design. At my age, I can't follow too many equities. I leave that the managers of our (wife and me) managed accounts. A very smart investor once wrote something to the effect - "put a lot of eggs in one basket and then watch the basket."
  • woodman: @Lou $ET $FTI #one-trick-pony - Well, I'm in because of all your posts. Most recently buying it in the consolidation area under the 50d from which it's emerging today.
  • marklesparkle: @Lou $ET Lou do you get free EIA reports from the website about crude,nat,propane the whole shebang <eia_elists@eia.gov>
  • Lou: @marklesparkle $ET Thanks - looked at the report. Not sure as to how to reconcile it with throughput via $ET and other pipelines, ET's pay and use it or lose it contracts, seasonal decline in usage because of the mild spring we're experiencing, liquification needs for export, and the myriad of other factors that go into pricing and capacity. All of this is above my paygrade, but I continue to have doubts about the replacement of fossil fuels by wind, water, sun, etc. The latest hair brained idea was to make our military vehicles powered by electricity. I guess we now need to install electric charges on all future battlefields and at strategic points in the sky to recharge plane batteries.
  • Lou: Back to my old policy, one that I used to share with @DAN that I've been violating lately, including today when I added $ET calls. @DAN has his hands full managing OMM and working in SMM, I have no similar obligations. Our philosophy was that anything that needs to be done on Friday, can wait until Monday. That said, it's Friday and I'm done for the week.
  • jonwest88: @Lou $ET Added some more the other day Stock is up today adjusted to the ex divvy now yielding close to 10% and lookin good
  • scottrades: Some Earnings after the close today: $AMD $F $SBUX $ET $SMCI $LTHM $CZR $PAYC $LUMN $MTCH $SPG $CLX $CHK $OKE $YUMC $WU $PRTS $DVAX $TRVG $SAR $PRU $ARWR $BAND $NRDS $SRPT $CWH $OHI $PACB $DENN $BGFV $MUSA $EQX $HLF $INSP $SPT $ANDE $APLE $WELL $AFG $CRK $AKR $EXPI $CLW $HRZN $MTW $FRSH $LSI $EXR $ATGE $UNM
  • scottrades: Some earnings to be aware of next week: $AAPL $SOFI $AMD $NCLH $UBER $SHOP $PFE $F $ON $AMC $SQ $CVS $YUM $ANET $QCOM $COIN $DKNG $ALB $CHKP $BP $BUD $DDOG $MRNA $ET $RCL $SEDG $ACMR $SMCI $MELI $GPN $SBUX $CNA $MGM $MAR $WBD $RIG $PK $MPC $FANG $EPD $NVO $PTON $STNG $FUBO $LNG $AMG $CAR $WEC $LYFT $LUMN
  • mopick: $ET, Announced an 0.8% increase in their dividend. More importantly, they're targeting 3-5% annual distribution growth rate. If it adheres to its current growth plan, its yield and annual growth make for a combined 13% yield. Meanwhile, their balance sheet is substantially better allowing for meaningful debt reduction with ample cash flow to support their yield.
  • Lou: @mopick $ET - agree - my largest position by far. The increase is only .0025 cents per quarter, with guidance that it will increase by a penny a year into the future. I guess a penny here and a penny there, before you know it you've got two cents and a real goose up of the unit price!
  • Lou: @mopick $ET - adding to my prior post, the small increase in the dividend leaves lots of free cash to buy back common and preferred units as well as to reduce debt.
  • Lou: @rj7150 $KMI - it's your money and your call. In my opinion, there are a number of other pipeline companies which likely have much better price and distribution growth ahead.
    As an old guy who is a US citizen and taxpayer, I love the MLPs like $ET a ...
  • Lou: @phgruver $PAA $PAGP #raised #News #before #Set-up #Fill-up #Pre-earning - there are some great K-1 issuing MLPs. Nice yield on the distributions, tax deferral, only not suitable for tax deferred accounts such as IRAs. Look at $ET and $EDP, for example.
  • Lou: @Lou $PAA $PAGP $ET $EDP #raised #News #before #Set-up #Fill-up #Pre-earning. Typo below - not EDP it's $EPD.
  • Lou: $ET continues to be my largest holding by far and, in addition to the Units of this MLP, I've been buying LEAP calls. I own a goodly number of 10s and 12s for 1/19/2024, and 8s for 1/17/2025. Not a lot of trading volume yet, but I'm expecting good LT CGs. Added a bit to the 8s for 2025 today.
  • Lou: More $ET 1/24 $10 calls. Overly full position in the stock. Calls are a cheap way to add.
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Stock Price $15.73
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